RE: [eurofaq] EU 'LIFELINE' IGNORED

3 messages

Originally from: David

Christina,

Please send the next Facts, Figures & Phantasies FREE by e-mail.

The number of animals that lost their lives thro the Governments mishandling of FMD2001 was 10–15 million and I think DEFRA has now admitted it to be the case. Not taken into account in the official figures were the healthy animals slaughtered on neighbouring farms (contiguous policy), animals slaughtered on the Livestock Welfare for Disposal Scheme (LWDS), the young progeny of those slaughtered plus any embryos inside the pregnant animals. (A sow with a litter of 15 piglets counted as ONE).

The other BIG scandle is that we will never know the extent of the "epidemic" (if there was one). Round about April 2001, the Government changed the policy to "slaughter on suspicion" which included the contiguous farms (= x each case by three of four?). At the beginning blood tests were taken to confirm the diagnosis, then it changed to kill and wait for the result of blood tests but so many came back negative that they finally dropped blood testing all together. OK, they were being overwhelmed with blood tests but samples should have been taken for later testing and we would then have KNOWN how much of an epidemic we actually had. In Gloucestershire there were (oficially) 78 cases with something like 78,000 animals (oficially) slaughtered. However, a local vet who helped DEFRA says that there were only SIX definite cases in the County.

David

-----Original Message-----
From: ...
Originally from: Christina Speight [...]
Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2002 11:53 PM
To: Christina Speight; ...; Alistair McConnachie; Ally. Belfagan; Am. Eykyn; Andrew Byron; Andrew Hall; Andrew Stephens; Arh4108; Bryn Wayt; Chris Phillips; Coleen Taylor; David Oakes; DI LAURIE; Dot Boag; Duncan Taylor; Epollard54; Felicity Hereward; FlaxMouswald; Gary Burkholder; H. L. Good; Hilary Paters; Hwoodcott; Jacquita Allender; Jane – Farmtalking; Jenni Allison-Kirby; John Gouriet; Jon Dobson; Jonathan Miller; Joyce; Ken Ward; Lynda FMD; Mary Armstrong; Michael Hart; Mike; Molly Maxwell; Nellie Mops; Nick Green; Petekind; Pippa; Richard Ceen; Richard Lawson; Richard North; Roger Gent; Roger Walker; Ron and Joyce Drew; Sheri Nakken; Shirley Reed; Simon Burbage; Sue Staunton; Tessa Kennedy; Tony York; Val Sinclair; Valerie Lusmore
Subject: Re: [eurofaq] EU 'LIFELINE' IGNORED
Not only am I making it my featured story but I have tonight reached 'Muckspreader' in Private Eye who has a short piece on the same subject.
No-one in the government will lift a finger to help. Why? One only has to examine the Foot & Mouth outbreak, the handling of which was under Blair¹s personal control, to see how incompetence allied to hostility came close to closing down our livestock industry altogether. With the totally unnecessary slaughter of 5 million healthy animals the farming industry was devastated. Our neighbours¹ farmers fare much better at the hands of their governments who by giving support directly to their farms draw down equal funds from Brussels. Blair will not do this and our own farmers¹ foreign competitors get so much better support that they can undercut the prices to our supermarkets. The total which our farmers are being denied is around £3.5 bn a year . Why? Tony Blair hates the robustly independent-minded farmers.
Christina
(Don't forget I can send the next Facts, Figures & Phantasies FREE by post or e-mail ... just ask!)
How do they get away with it ? why or what can we do ? why is there no one
out there to fight our corner for us, by that I mean in our government
It's
a bleak out look
Regards Jill
From: Christina Speight <...>
Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 17:47:39 +0100
To: <...>, Alistair McConnachie
<...>, "Ally. Belfagan"
<...>,
"Am. Eykyn" <...>, Andrew Byron
<...>, Andrew Hall <...>,
Andrew
Stephens <...>, Arh4108 <...>, Bryn Wayt
<...>, Chris Phillips
<...>,
Coleen Taylor <...>, David Oakes
<...>, DI LAURIE <...>, Dot Boag
<...>, Duncan Taylor <...>,
Epollard54 <...>, Felicity Hereward
<...>, FlaxMouswald <...>, Gary
Burkholder <...>, "H. L. Good"
<...>,
Hilary Paters <...>, Hwoodcott
<...>, Jacquita Allender <...>,
Jane –
Farmtalking <...>, Jenni Allison-Kirby
<...>, John Gouriet <...>, Jon
Dobson <...>, Jonathan Miller
<...>, Joyce
<...>,
Ken Ward <...>, Lynda FMD <...>,
Mary
Armstrong <...>, Michael Hart
<...>, Mike <...>, Molly Maxwell
<...>, Nellie Mops <...>, Nick Green
<...>, Petekind <...>, Pippa
<...>, Richard Ceen <...>, Richard Lawson
<...>, Richard North <...>, Roger Gent
<...>, Roger Walker <...>,
Ron
and Joyce Drew <...>, Sheri Nakken
<...>, Shirley Reed
<...>,
Simon Burbage <...>, Sue Staunton
<...>, Tessa Kennedy <...>,
Tony
York <...>, Val Sinclair
<...>,
Valerie Lusmore <...>
Subject: Re: [eurofaq] EU 'LIFELINE' IGNORED
The lead story in the next Facts, Figures & Phantasies [FREE ON REQUEST
...advt!] is all about "How to kill an Industry" and the industry is
farming.
The figure of unclaimed subsidies/grants etc is the astonishing £300m a
year
or £1.2 bn in the last four years. if you add to that the subsidies which
all
our competitors get the shortfall is £3.5 billion A YEAR!
The one vital point is that our farmers are being ruined and nobody in
government cares a damn for them. The EU contributes to this outrage by a
scheme designed to tie Britain inescapably into the web of EU-directed
subsidies. This conveniently provides an almost impenetrable smokescreen
for
Tony Blair and his country-hating ministers to hide behind.
christina
From: "David" <...>
Reply-To: ...
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 14:09:03 +0100
To: "Fmdnew" <...>, "Eurofaq"
<...>,
"..." <...>, "Sue
Sampson"
<...>, "Alistair McConnachie"
<...>, "Ally. Belfagan"
<...>,
"Am. Eykyn" <...>, "Andrew Byron"
<...>, "Andrew Hall" <...>,
"Andrew
Stephens" <...>, "Arh4108" <...>, "Bryn
Wayt"
<...>, "Chris Phillips"
<...>, "Coleen Taylor"
<...>, "David Oakes"
<...>,
"DI LAURIE" <...>, "Dot Boag" <...>,
"Duncan
Taylor" <...>, "Epollard54"
<...>, "Felicity Hereward"
<...>,
"FlaxMouswald" <...>, "Gary Burkholder"
<...>, "H. L. Good" <...>,
"Hilary
Paters" <...>, "Hwoodcott"
<...>,
"Jacquita Allender" <...>, "Jane – Farmtalking"
<...>, "Jenni Allison-Kirby" <...>,
"John Gouriet" <...>, "Jon Dobson"
<...>, "Jonathan Miller"
<...>, "Joyce"
<...>,
"Ken Ward" <...>, "Lynda FMD"
<...>,
"Mary Armstrong" <...>, "Michael Hart"
<...>, "Mike" <...>, "Molly
Maxwell"
<...>, "Nellie Mops" <...>, "Nick
Green"
<...>, "Petekind" <...>,
"Pippa"
<...>, "Richard Ceen" <...>, "Richard Lawson"
<...>, "Richard North" <...>, "Roger Gent"
<...>, "Roger Walker" <...>,
"Ron
and Joyce Drew" <...>, "Sheri Nakken"
<...>, "Shirley Reed"
<...>,
"Simon Burbage" <...>, "Sue Staunton"
<...>, "Tessa Kennedy" <...>,
"Tony
York" <...>, "Val Sinclair"
<...>,
"Valerie Lusmore" <...>
Subject: [eurofaq] EU 'LIFELINE' IGNORED
http://www.westpress.co.uk/displayNode.jsp?nodeId=71037&command=displayConte
nt&sourceNode=70589&contentPK=2517181
EU 'LIFELINE' IGNORED
11:00 – 05 September 2002
The Government has failed to take up millions of pounds of European
funds set aside to compensate British farmers.
The cash was intended to even out shortfalls caused by disparity
between the pound and the euro, in which EU farm prices are calculated.
But
a new European Commission report reveals that £42million went unclaimed.
The revelation has brought immediate condemnation from the
Conservatives' agriculture spokesman in the European Parliament, Somerset
farmer Neil Parish.
He said ministers had failed to take advantage of a lifeline which it
offered for many producers. Labour has repeatedly been reluctant to take
up
agri-monetary aid because around 70 per cent of it has to come from
Treasury
funds – the result of the Fontainebleau deal negotiated by Margaret
Thatcher.
But, says Mr Parish, for Ministers to pass up the chance of claiming
cash at a time when it has never been needed more was wrong.
"The decision not to claim any part of the agri-monetary aids designed
to compensate the beef, sheep and dairy industry, will be no comfort to
those farmers in the South West trying to stave off bankruptcy, " he
said.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
EuroFAQ – a Eurosceptic Resource – http://members.aol.com/eurofaq
Opinions
expressed on this list are those of contributors and are not necessarily
endorsed by EuroFAQ nor its Editors.
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~--> Looking for a more powerful website? Try GeoCities for $8.95 per month. Register your domain name (http://your-name.com). More storage! No ads! http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info
http://us.click.yahoo.com/aHOo4D/KJoEAA/MVfIAA/XgSolB/™;
---------------------------------------------------------------------~->
EuroFAQ – a Eurosceptic Resource – http://members.aol.com/eurofaq Opinions expressed on this list are those of contributors and are not necessarily endorsed by EuroFAQ nor its Editors.
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Originally from: Burkie

So why don't you both go to Pirbright and ask to see the actual results of the tests?

You should have a "right" to do that.

Pirbright cannot withhold those test results, if you ask for them.

No one has done this. Which amazes me.

Burkie in Kansas

Author wrote:
Christina,
Please send the next Facts, Figures & Phantasies FREE by e-mail.
The number of animals that lost their lives thro the Governments mishandling
of FMD2001 was 10–15 million and I think DEFRA has now admitted it to be the
case. Not taken into account in the official figures were the healthy
animals slaughtered on neighbouring farms (contiguous policy), animals
slaughtered on the Livestock Welfare for Disposal Scheme (LWDS), the young
progeny of those slaughtered plus any embryos inside the pregnant animals.
(A sow with a litter of 15 piglets counted as ONE).
The other BIG scandle is that we will never know the extent of the
"epidemic" (if there was one). Round about April 2001, the Government
changed the policy to "slaughter on suspicion" which included the contiguous
farms (= x each case by three of four?). At the beginning blood tests were
taken to confirm the diagnosis, then it changed to kill and wait for the
result of blood tests but so many came back negative that they finally
dropped blood testing all together. OK, they were being overwhelmed with
blood tests but samples should have been taken for later testing and we
would then have KNOWN how much of an epidemic we actually had. In
Gloucestershire there were (oficially) 78 cases with something like 78,000
animals (oficially) slaughtered. However, a local vet who helped DEFRA says
that there were only SIX definite cases in the County.
David
-----Original Message-----
From: Christina Speight [...]
Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2002 11:53 PM
To: Christina Speight; ...; Alistair McConnachie;
Ally. Belfagan; Am. Eykyn; Andrew Byron; Andrew Hall; Andrew Stephens;
Arh4108; Bryn Wayt; Chris Phillips; Coleen Taylor; David Oakes; DI
LAURIE; Dot Boag; Duncan Taylor; Epollard54; Felicity Hereward;
FlaxMouswald; Gary Burkholder; H. L. Good; Hilary Paters; Hwoodcott;
Jacquita Allender; Jane – Farmtalking; Jenni Allison-Kirby; John
Gouriet; Jon Dobson; Jonathan Miller; Joyce; Ken Ward; Lynda FMD; Mary
Armstrong; Michael Hart; Mike; Molly Maxwell; Nellie Mops; Nick Green;
Petekind; Pippa; Richard Ceen; Richard Lawson; Richard North; Roger
Gent; Roger Walker; Ron and Joyce Drew; Sheri Nakken; Shirley Reed;
Simon Burbage; Sue Staunton; Tessa Kennedy; Tony York; Val Sinclair;
Valerie Lusmore
Subject: Re: [eurofaq] EU 'LIFELINE' IGNORED
Not only am I making it my featured story but I have tonight reached
'Muckspreader' in Private Eye who has a short piece on the same subject.
No-one in the government will lift a finger to help. Why? One only has to
examine the Foot & Mouth outbreak, the handling of which was under Blair¹s
personal control, to see how incompetence allied to hostility came close to
closing down our livestock industry altogether. With the totally
unnecessary slaughter of 5 million healthy animals the farming industry was
devastated. Our neighbours¹ farmers fare much better at the hands of their
governments who by giving support directly to their farms draw down equal
funds from Brussels. Blair will not do this and our own farmers¹ foreign
competitors get so much better support that they can undercut the prices to
our supermarkets. The total which our farmers are being denied is around
£3.5 bn a year . Why? Tony Blair hates the robustly independent-minded
farmers.
Christina
(Don't forget I can send the next Facts, Figures & Phantasies FREE by post
or e-mail ... just ask!)
How do they get away with it ? why or what can we do ? why is there no one
out there to fight our corner for us, by that I mean in our government
It's
a bleak out look
Regards Jill
From: Christina Speight <...>
Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 17:47:39 +0100
To: <...>, Alistair McConnachie
<...>, "Ally. Belfagan"
<...>,
"Am. Eykyn" <...>, Andrew Byron
<...>, Andrew Hall <...>,
Andrew
Stephens <...>, Arh4108 <...>, Bryn Wayt
<...>, Chris Phillips
<...>,
Coleen Taylor <...>, David Oakes
<...>, DI LAURIE <...>, Dot Boag
<...>, Duncan Taylor <...>,
Epollard54 <...>, Felicity Hereward
<...>, FlaxMouswald <...>, Gary
Burkholder <...>, "H. L. Good"
<...>,
Hilary Paters <...>, Hwoodcott
<...>, Jacquita Allender <...>,
Jane –
Farmtalking <...>, Jenni Allison-Kirby
<...>, John Gouriet <...>, Jon
Dobson <...>, Jonathan Miller
<...>, Joyce
<...>,
Ken Ward <...>, Lynda FMD <...>,
Mary
Armstrong <...>, Michael Hart
<...>, Mike <...>, Molly Maxwell
<...>, Nellie Mops <...>, Nick Green
<...>, Petekind <...>, Pippa
<...>, Richard Ceen <...>, Richard Lawson
<...>, Richard North <...>, Roger Gent
<...>, Roger Walker <...>,
Ron
and Joyce Drew <...>, Sheri Nakken
<...>, Shirley Reed
<...>,
Simon Burbage <...>, Sue Staunton
<...>, Tessa Kennedy <...>,
Tony
York <...>, Val Sinclair
<...>,
Valerie Lusmore <...>
Subject: Re: [eurofaq] EU 'LIFELINE' IGNORED
The lead story in the next Facts, Figures & Phantasies [FREE ON REQUEST
...advt!] is all about "How to kill an Industry" and the industry is
farming.
The figure of unclaimed subsidies/grants etc is the astonishing £300m a
year
or £1.2 bn in the last four years. if you add to that the subsidies which
all
our competitors get the shortfall is £3.5 billion A YEAR!
The one vital point is that our farmers are being ruined and nobody in
government cares a damn for them. The EU contributes to this outrage by a
scheme designed to tie Britain inescapably into the web of EU-directed
subsidies. This conveniently provides an almost impenetrable smokescreen
for
Tony Blair and his country-hating ministers to hide behind.
christina
From: "David" <...>
Reply-To: ...
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 14:09:03 +0100
To: "Fmdnew" <...>, "Eurofaq"
<...>,
"..." <...>, "Sue
Sampson"
<...>, "Alistair McConnachie"
<...>, "Ally. Belfagan"
<...>,
"Am. Eykyn" <...>, "Andrew Byron"
<...>, "Andrew Hall" <...>,
"Andrew
Stephens" <...>, "Arh4108" <...>, "Bryn
Wayt"
<...>, "Chris Phillips"
<...>, "Coleen Taylor"
<...>, "David Oakes"
<...>,
"DI LAURIE" <...>, "Dot Boag" <...>,
"Duncan
Taylor" <...>, "Epollard54"
<...>, "Felicity Hereward"
<...>,
"FlaxMouswald" <...>, "Gary Burkholder"
<...>, "H. L. Good" <...>,
"Hilary
Paters" <...>, "Hwoodcott"
<...>,
"Jacquita Allender" <...>, "Jane – Farmtalking"
<...>, "Jenni Allison-Kirby" <...>,
"John Gouriet" <...>, "Jon Dobson"
<...>, "Jonathan Miller"
<...>, "Joyce"
<...>,
"Ken Ward" <...>, "Lynda FMD"
<...>,
"Mary Armstrong" <...>, "Michael Hart"
<...>, "Mike" <...>, "Molly
Maxwell"
<...>, "Nellie Mops" <...>, "Nick
Green"
<...>, "Petekind" <...>,
"Pippa"
<...>, "Richard Ceen" <...>, "Richard Lawson"
<...>, "Richard North" <...>, "Roger Gent"
<...>, "Roger Walker" <...>,
"Ron
and Joyce Drew" <...>, "Sheri Nakken"
<...>, "Shirley Reed"
<...>,
"Simon Burbage" <...>, "Sue Staunton"
<...>, "Tessa Kennedy" <...>,
"Tony
York" <...>, "Val Sinclair"
<...>,
"Valerie Lusmore" <...>
Subject: [eurofaq] EU 'LIFELINE' IGNORED
http://www.westpress.co.uk/displayNode.jsp?nodeId=71037&command=displayConte
nt&sourceNode=70589&contentPK=2517181
EU 'LIFELINE' IGNORED
11:00 – 05 September 2002
The Government has failed to take up millions of pounds of European
funds set aside to compensate British farmers.
The cash was intended to even out shortfalls caused by disparity
between the pound and the euro, in which EU farm prices are calculated.
But
a new European Commission report reveals that £42million went unclaimed.
The revelation has brought immediate condemnation from the
Conservatives' agriculture spokesman in the European Parliament, Somerset
farmer Neil Parish.
He said ministers had failed to take advantage of a lifeline which it
offered for many producers. Labour has repeatedly been reluctant to take
up
agri-monetary aid because around 70 per cent of it has to come from
Treasury
funds – the result of the Fontainebleau deal negotiated by Margaret
Thatcher.
But, says Mr Parish, for Ministers to pass up the chance of claiming
cash at a time when it has never been needed more was wrong.
"The decision not to claim any part of the agri-monetary aids designed
to compensate the beef, sheep and dairy industry, will be no comfort to
those farmers in the South West trying to stave off bankruptcy, " he
said.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
EuroFAQ – a Eurosceptic Resource – http://members.aol.com/eurofaq
Opinions
expressed on this list are those of contributors and are not necessarily
endorsed by EuroFAQ nor its Editors.
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~-->
Looking for a more powerful website? Try GeoCities for $8.95 per month.
Register your domain name (http://your-name.com). More storage! No ads!
http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info
http://us.click.yahoo.com/aHOo4D/KJoEAA/MVfIAA/XgSolB/™;
---------------------------------------------------------------------~->
EuroFAQ – a Eurosceptic Resource – http://members.aol.com/eurofaq Opinions
expressed on this list are those of contributors and are not necessarily
endorsed by EuroFAQ nor its Editors.
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Originally from: Bill

David, blood tests mostly don't work because whoever devised the tests in the 1950's didn't know the virus spends most of it's lifecycle in the lymphatic system.

MAAF's huge problem was they didn't rely on original research but put their trust in "large numbers of scientific papers on foot and mouth disease". These so called "scientific papers" can all be traced back to the original work by Loeffler and Frosch.

Unfortunately it's like Chinese whispers and a lot of the important stuff gets mislaid or misinterpreted along the way. The public have a misguided view of science and believe research goes on forever but in virology once a virus has been investigated the scientists move on.

Nothing was done in FMD research from the 1900's until the 1960's and 70's when vaccines were developed. The authoritative work on virus lifecycle is still Loeffler and Frosch.

Bill.