Jiglu: Farmtalking: Discussion: Re: RE: Defra''''s scrapie plan

Originally from: coleen

Dear Jane

So how do we go about being open and honest with them. Do we say 'here are our animals come and test them'? Knowing full well that they could do and say whatever they liked regarding any test results. What then? We could not protest – they would simply arrest us, whilst they destroyed the animals. So what is there to understand on our part – and as for honesty they forfeited that when they lied over fmd. I do not see how we can give them a second chance, not when animals are involved. You cannot bring them back to life once you have placed your faith and trust in DEFRA. I am sorry Jane but it is not worth the risk. It is for them to unravel the mess and lies. Why if they are to be given a second chance do they keep lying time and time again. Does not the condemned man always say he is 'sorry' before sentencing – how many go on to reoffend?

I do not think that they are trying to mend any bridges rather the opposite, but then lets face it they do not have to. They have the AHA to fall back on. We have nothing other then our wits and the knowledge that to openly invite them in would be foolhardy. This to me is not a game and second chances are all well and good when both parties stand on equal footing and both parties want to reach a mutual and friendly conclusion.

I simply ask this, if fmd and the way it was treated had been a genuine mistake would we not have had some answers and the word 'sorry' mentioned in some quarters. To do what they did to people and their animals was disgusting – they should be so ashamed. I would struggle to live with myself Jane if I had inflicted the pain and suffering some of them were quilty of. In some cases they acted little better then scum (sorry but no other word fits the crime).Only difference being the people who we normally attach that description to – would have served time for it.

They have prove that they are not out to destroy our animals first, and from were I sit this is not a view I see at the moment.

Coleen

----- Original Message -----
From: ...
Originally from: <...>
To: <...>
Sent: Sunday, September 28, 2003 10:08 AM
Subject: [farmtalking] RE: Defra''s scrapie plan
Hi Francis!
Here's a few answers to your message –
Author wrote:
Now, there's a misnomer if ever I wrote one ? A plan ? One that, as per
usual, leads to eventual carnage. That is Defra's answer to everything remotely described as a zoonosis(i.e. it may be transmissable to man ).Now, I wonder why they do not come clean about PMWS in the pig herds, that has a suspicion(as yet unconfirmed) of being in that category and yet they refuse to make it a notifiable disease ! Is this because it is now so rampant that the compensation bill would be enormous ? So much for our marvellous Food Standards Agency.

JB – Yes you are right inasmuch as there seems to be an almightly
'muddle'!

I am suggesting that if we don't understand something we ask that it be
explained.

I wonder how many of us have written to our MP's and 'asked' if the NSP is
going to lead to 'eventual carnage' and why?

The same applies to your queries about PMWS. –
As regards trust, Jane. Trust has to be earned.
JB – So I understand. Doesn't the way to earn trust lie in a two-way
exchange of honesty, openness and understanding? –

Would you say that ANY farmer or anyone who keeps animals trusts Defra ?
JB – Did I say that? I don't think so! –
Secondly, when trust has been lost, as it most certainly has,it cannot be
regained, it has gone forever.

JB – I'm sorry to disagree with you but trust is only 'gone forever' if
that is how we want it to be. –

If you were daft enough or still naive enough to invite Defra onto your
land to test, check your stock, could they be trusted ?

Would some of us even trust any results of blood testing that they carried
out, or that they had not falsified these ? Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when first we practise to deceive ?

JB – Quite! but do we want to maintain the tangle or unravel it? –
Basically, they are up the creek without a paddle, don't know what to do
about it, and end up still digging the hole(to mix my metaphors completely). There is no doubt in a lot of our minds, that the SVS is a corrupt body and needs sorting before any progress can be made.

JB – I don't think the SVS is a 'corrupt body' but is underfunded,
understaffed and lacks up to date training and it's these deficiencies which have led to incompetance. –

I think many vets are only just realising that they have been trussed up
like an oven ready chicken (our sons would use another graphic way to describe it ). But, no, we cannot trust those who have proved themselves untrustworthy, not when so much is at stake.

JB – Did I ask you to do so? I don't think so! – What I do ask is that we
try to forgive those who've destroyed our trust and talk to them in order to understand the problems from every angle and find the right way forward. –

Please.,do not forget that some actually took their own lives, as a result
indirect or even, direct of these people and their policies.

JB. – Of course I do not and never will, forget. –
Where they leave us no hope, then we have nothing to lose by opposition.
JB. – Again I have to disagree with you. I think that to constantly
'oppose' is to maintain conflict and thereby we lose everything.

Hurt and angry though we may be don't we have to try to be 'constructive'
to find the right way forward?

Best wishes and take care! – Jane
Frances

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